Bottom Bracket Adjustment

[mikesbytes]

The crank on the chainring side on my fixie is rubbing against the frame. On the other side I have about 6mm of clearance between the pedal end of the crank and the frame.

The bottom bracket is square taper.

Can I adjust the bottom bracket right by about 1mm?

[christian]

Depending on the BB, here I'm guessing its the standard shimano type or similar. The solution is to get a BB spacer and put it under the drive side. As the non-drive side does not have a flange you can just wind the locking sleeve in a bit further.

[Toff]

Christian's solution should work, but there is a chance that you may have an asymetric bottom bracket spindle put in the wrong way round. The solution would be to fix that first.

I suspect you have put some different cranks on your fixie after the last ones broke. Have you confirmed that the drive side square taper is still good?

[mikesbytes]

It's got an old road crank, that I scored off Lindsay after that crash on Jan 29th 2010.

The replacement old road crank has always been right up against the frame but now its started rubbing.

I wouldn't be surprised if the taper is dead.

If I'm going to throw any real money at it, I'd rather get some new bling for the track bike and stick the existing track cranks on it.

[mikesbytes]

Even the original crank was really close to the frame, so I kinda suspect that I'll need the spacer or a new bottom bracket, even if I buy new cranks

[Toff]

Even the original crank was really close to the frame, so I kinda suspect that I'll need the spacer or a new bottom bracket, even if I buy new cranks

...or maybe just a longer bottom bracket spindle.

[mikesbytes]

It's probably a sealed unit

[mikesbytes]

It's giving me grief, I can't get the drive side cap undone, I think I'll need to put it in someones vice (who's got one).

According to park tools, I loosen off forwards, which I'm doing

http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=94

Also the thread used to remove the non drive side crank arm is done, I got it off, but I ain't going to put it back on.

[shrubb face]

If its an english bb then the drive side thread is reversed hence u undo it by turning it clockwise.
If its an italian then the drive side is standard thread.

[mikesbytes]

How do I know if I've got english or italian?

[Toff]

You've got English if it's your Fuji. Only Italian bikes have Italian thread on the BB (except for Eddy Merckxs which are made in Belgium, but are Italian in all other respects).

Italian cups are marked 36 mm x 24 TPI
ISO or English is marked 1.37 in x 24 TPI or 1.375 in x 24 TPI

I'm pretty sure the tool box at Tempe has the proper tool to loosen a fixed cup, since I removed an English BB myself down there six months ago.

[mikesbytes]

I've got the correct tool, it just doesn't want to come to the party

[Karzie]

I've got the correct tool, it just doesn't want to come to the party

You're obviously not swearing hard enough.

[Toff]

Try putting a bit of pipe over the end of the handle to create more leverage. If that fails, I vise will work. Unfortunately I don't have one though. If you do use a vise, I would recommend making some cover plates from aluminium to go over the vise. This will protect the frame and fixed cup from gouges.

[mikesbytes]

I think it needs 2 people and a vice.

BTW I've concluded that the initial problem was not the crank rubbing on the frame but the bottom bracket itself

[Karzie]

Alan Sumner's your man, I reckon.

[Peter T]

Hi Mike,
You can't beat lots of soaking in wd40 or preferably Inox or penetrating oil. If you have the time, apply it over a few days and you might get the Hey Presto Moment.

I have a bicycle trained vice in the workshop if you need to use it.

Let me know.

[mikesbytes]

Thanks Peter, I've applied wd40 as suggested.

I would like to take you up on using your vice, I can walk the bike over to St Peters

[mikesbytes]

Thanks Peter that vice of yours and your engineering skills did the trick.

Now I need to purchase a new bottom bracket. The one that came out of it is;
MIDUS (though the I is hard to read)
Sealed ball bearing cartridge
BC-73
68
BC 1.37x24T
LP components
L <-110.5mm->R

I take it to be a stanadard Shimano square taper stlye cartridge, 110.5mm.

[mikesbytes]

So many options, each at a different price point

1. buy a nice set, put it on the track bike and migrate the existing track bike parts to the fixie. For example;
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll ... 0449942684

2. get a set of 144 cranks for the fixie. There were plenty of cheap ones around at 165, but I don't want to go shorter than 170, which left this example;
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Genetic-Tibia-Fi ... 0529893736
Would use a spare 48t ring I already have

3. coming down the price path a bit more, there were numerous examples of 130's
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Crank-Set-Single ... 0296549782
or cheaper again
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Track-fixie-fixe ... 0610743988

4. if I wanted to be seriously cheap, I could go this one and biff it when the ring wore out
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Crank-Set-Single ... 0380402679

Also, what do you think of this ring for the track bike? Or should I get one from a reputable brand?
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Chain-Ring-Track ... 0381803016

[christian]

Mike, with your record with cranks I don't know if I'd recommend carbon.

[mikesbytes]

So the FSA ones are out?

[Toff]

I would hold off on buying the bottom bracket until you've decided on the cranks. Track crank bottom bracket spindles are a bit longer than road ones, but they vary between ~107mm to ~111mm.

In order to have the q-factor that the cranks were designed to have, I would suggest using a spindle length that matches the crank manufacturer's specifications.

When you buy the cranks, ask the seller what the bottom bracket spindle length is. Also ask if the taper is ISO or JIS. Then buy a bottom bracket with matching specifications.

I'm not sure if your plan is to get new cranks for the track bike, and move your track bike cranks to the fixie, but if that is your plan, then I would consider buying a bottom bracket that that has the same specifications as your current track bottom bracket. That way, if you break another set of cranks (on either bike), you can simply swap the cranks over, and everything will work perfectly, with no q-factor issues, and no striking cranks on the chainstays.

Of course there is nothing to stop you getting a set of cranks and bottom bracket with different specs. You can simply swap the cranks and the bottom bracket together if you do a swap. They way you break things though, Mike, I think it would be safer to go with compatible parts...

Also, one last thing... I would avoid buying really cheap cranks, and cheap chainrings. They are not machined to the same high tolerances as high-end cranks and rings. The result is that you can end up with your chainring off-centre. An eccentric chainring will cause the chain tension to rise and fall with each crank rotation. This will wear out your chain and chainring much faster, and could even lead to chain breakage.

[mikesbytes]

Thanks.

How do I select a quality crank? Do I restrict myself to particular brands?

[mikesbytes]

Miche Primato Advanced Track Chainset 170 50T

$158 delivered. And I get a 50T which I wanted for the track bike

[shrubb face]

Make sure you check mike, some miche track cranks arent 144 BCD.

[mikesbytes]

My understanding is that the word "advanced" means 144. However to make sure I went to the Miche web site

http://www.miche.it/en/catalogo/catalog ... nced-pista

And guess what... they haven't stated the BCD on their web site

However, if I go to other sites, it says 144 http://www.velodromeshop.org.uk/index.p ... uct&id=249

Annoying isn't it

[T-Bone]

I can confirm that the Miche Advanced chainrings are 144, and seeing as one is attached to the cranks in the pic, i guess we assume the cranks are too.

[mikesbytes]

I've put my order in. Also ordered a Miche bottom bracket.

Should of ordered a chain while I was at it, suppose I'll get one from Al's

[mikesbytes]

Picked up a Sedis chain from Al's.

Yet to receive the Miche cranks. When I do, should I put them on the track bike and put the Sugino ones on the fixie?

[timyone]

If its an english bb then the drive side thread is reversed hence u undo it by turning it clockwise.
If its an italian then the drive side is standard thread.

how do you know all this stuff?!!

[shrubb face]

lol, reading lots, listening lots, oh and being a engineer helps.

[mikesbytes]

Decided to put the Miche cranks on the Raceline and move the Surgeno 75's to the Fuji

[mikesbytes]

Anyone got a Miche bottom bracket tool?

[Toff]

I'm pretty sure the Miche bottom bracket tool is the same as the Campagnolo bottom bracket tool. I have a couple of those, still unused in their original bags. Ron Colwell also has the tool, since he removed the Miche bottom bracket off my road bike.

Incedently, on the Miche Website that you show above, there is a link to "download instructions". The instructions tell you to install the cranks onto the spindle using an 8mm allen key with a tightening torque of 350 Nm. That's massive. I suspect that would strip or snap the bolts if it didn't snap the allen key first!

[shrubb face]

He would struggle to put that much torque into bolt anyway. Assuming a 20cm long allen key, and that he applies the force right at the end, he'd need to put approximatly 175kgs of force onto the allen key.

Super Mike.

[mikesbytes]

Toff, do you have a spare one you want to sell me? If not can I borrow yours?

[Toff]

Mine aren't for sale.

I will consider opening one of my packets and lending you the tool if you want.

Otherwise...

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Park-BBT-5-Casse ... 0469257025
or
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Bottom-Bracket-a ... 0352023629
or
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Bottom-Bracket-L ... 0352023872
or
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Bottom-Bracket-a ... 0218564540

[mikesbytes]

OK, what I'll do is borrow your tool and having proven its Campag compatible, buy one for future use.

BTW, I'm leaving St Leonards at 6 if your riding home

[Toff]

I was going to ride, but scored a car at the last moment. I have to go and pick something up tonight.

I will be at RAW on Friday.

[mikesbytes]

I won't be at raw, I've done 6 spin classes this week already and I have a 7th on Friday and an 8th on Saturday

[mikesbytes]

Finally restarted commuting on the fixie, had it together a couple of weeks ago, but didn't get it out the door. 80" seems fine, didn't notice at all climbing.

Bike has 2 problems;
1. The chain line isn't perfectly straight. I can see it but I can't feel it. How much is a concern? Solution is a narrower BB.
2. The head set keeps coming loose, I tighten the bolt on top but it comes loose again